Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.5.22 Pradyumna: Translation: “Learned circles have positively concluded that the infallible purpose of the advancement of knowledge, namely austerities, study of the Vedas, sacrifice, chanting of hymns and charity, culminates in the transcendental descriptions of the Lord, who is defined in choice poetry.” Devotee: Would you like the stand to be lower? Prabhupada: No. idam hi pumsas tapasah srutasya va svistasya suktasya ca buddhi-dattayoh avicyuto ’rthah kavibhir nirupito yad-uttamasloka-gunanuvarnanam [SB 1.5.22] So this is our mission, that find out the original cause. That is scientific research. All the scientists, they are trying to find out the original cause. That is advancement of education. They are analyzing one after another. But till now, they could not find it out. Big, big scientists have tried. But they could not… Only theory: “This is the original cause. This is the original cause.” But we do not depend on the theories. We depend on the Vedic conclusion. We do not require to make any research. Just like ordinarily we say there are 900,000 forms of body in the water. We get it from Vedic knowledge. Jalaja nava-laksani. Now, the biologists, let them confirm it. Or deny it. Because… They cannot confirm it because their knowledge is experimental. Unless they find it actually, by actual experience, that there are so many living forms within the water, they cannot say yes. Neither they are able to find it out. Is it not the position? First of all, if we say to the biologists that “There are 900,000 different forms of life or species within the water,” they will say, “How it is you are affirming in, so positively, without experiment, without research?” They’ll say. Then we’ll ask, “Then you say.” That they cannot say. This is their position. They’ll say, “In future…” Future, there is no question. You do not know now. Admit this. So this is their position. Therefore this experimental knowledge is always imperfect. Always imperfect. It cannot be perfect. Because our experience, our power of perception, advancement of knowledge, they are imperfect. They are deficiency. Therefore, for perfect knowledge, you have to approach the perfect. We accept Lord Krsna as the perfect, and His bona fide representative is also perfect. How he is perfect? Krsna may be perfect, one may admit, but how his bona fide representative is also perfect? So the answer is the bona fide representative of Krsna, he does not say anything beyond Krsna. That is perfect. He may be imperfect. It doesn’t matter. But he is receiving knowledge from the perfect, and he’s simply repeating that knowledge. That is the instruction of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu. Yare dekha tare kaha, kaha krsna-katha. Yare dekha tare kaha krsna-katha. yare dekha, tare kaha ‘krsna’-upadesa amara ajnaya guru hana tara’ ei desa [Cc. Madhya 7.128] You don’t speak your upadesa, your instruction. That is nonsense. What you are? That is the defect of the modern civilization. They simply want to instruct by his experience. But what is your experience? They’re all imperfect. But they are persisting, “No, we cannot accept any knowledge without experiment.” Is it not the position. Eh? Svarupa Damodara: Experiments. Prabhupada: Eh? Svarupa Damodara: They’re after. Prabhupada: Now, that the scientists will say, “Why we shall accept Krsna’s version as perfect?” Do they not say like that? Svarupa Damodara: Yes, they ask. Prabhupada: But they cannot give any perfect information, their theories. So our process is to take Krsna… Not only our, this is the parampara system. All the acaryas—Ramanujacarya, Madhvacarya— they take Krsna’s version as perfect. And Caitanya Mahaprabhu says, therefore, that “You do not instruct anything which is manufactured by you. Do not instruct all these…” Because you are imperfect. You have manufactured all your theories. They are imperfect. Caitanya Mahaprabhu therefore says, yare dekha tare kaha krsna-upadesa [Cc. Madhya 7.128] This is perfection. If you say Krsna’s upadesa, instruction, then it is perfect. And if you say your experimental instruction, that is imperfect. Here it is said that idam hi pumsas tapasah… Every knowledge… Just like here is our Dr. Svarupa Damodara. He has got the doctorate title. We have seen your book. It is a learned scholarship, research work. So that is nice. But he has admitted the original cause is Krsna. So we are asking everyone that “Whatever knowledge you have got…” It doesn’t matter whether you are a chemist or physicist or an engineer or medical man… Any… There are so many. Lawyer, politician. So many departmental knowledge. So one becomes doctor and expert by high research work. For the last… How many years you were in USA? Svarupa Damodara: I think five years. Prabhupada: Five years. After five years hard work and placing the theses among the learned scholars, they admitted, “Yes, it is very nice research work.” Now they have offered him a Ph.D. So it is tapasya. Tapasya. Without tapasya, you cannot get any credit. That is not possible. If one wants to get credit immediately, without tapasya, that is bogus. Therefore it is said, tapasah, and srutasya. Srutasya means hearing from the authorities. By attending lectures of the professors, of the scientific scholars, hearing. Or Vedic knowledge. So anyway, everyone is getting knowledge, perfection, by tapasya, by austerity, by learned scholarship. So here it is said that, that these things are required for describing Krsna. These things are required for describing Krsna. Not only on the theory, but actually to prove that this knowledge is there, Krsna is full of all opulences, and… It is said… Jnana, jnana-vairagyayos caiva sannam bhaga itingana. Eh? What is the beginning? Aisvaryasya samagrasya viryasya yasasah sriyah. Krsna means He’s the full opulent Personality of Godhead with all riches, all reputation, all beauty, all knowledge. That you have to prove. Any department of knowledge, you have to prove that it…, this knowledge is coming from Krsna. Sarva-karana-karanam [Bs. 5.1]. isvarah paramah krsnah sac-cid-ananda-vigrahah anadir adir govindah sarva-karana-karanam [Bs. 5.1] That is Krsna consciousness. (aside:) Let him sit down properly. That is scholarship. You make research work, but… In the sastra it is said that Krsna is the original person of this departmental knowledge. Suppose you are a lawyer. So Krsna gives the law. This is research work. Just actually Krsna gives. What is Krsna gives? Sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66] This is law. The first giver of law is Krsna, that “You give up all nonsense. Surrender unto Me.” This is law. Then you’ll understand everything. Man-mana bhava mad-bhakto mad-yaji mam namaskuru [Bg. 18.65]. Religion means the law given by Krsna, or God. That is religion. Otherwise, it is not religion. That is cheating. Dharmah projjhita-kaitavo ’tra [SB 1.1.2]. This is cheating religion. If you do not follow Krsna, that is cheating. “Krsna” means… When I say “Krsna,” Krsna means God. God is one. That is Krsna. Others, they admit that God is one. But they do not know who is that one God. That is their defect. That is the difference between us and others. They do not know… Just like if I say that “Have you got any father?” So he’ll say, “Yes, I have got my father.” “Now, who is your father?” “I do not know.” That’s not a very good credit. Because without father, mother, there is no existence. So everyone knows I have got a father. But who is my father, that I do not know. At least, in India, one who cannot say his father’s name, immediately he becomes degraded. Just like the Jabala Satyakama. Jabala Satyakama, he, he was… He went to Gautama Muni, “Please initiate me.” And according to Vedic conclu…, initiation is meant for the brahmana. Brahmana, ksatriya and vaisya. Not for the sudras. Sudras are not initiated. And in the Kali-yuga, because everyone is a sudra, therefore he’s first of all given training to become a brahmana. Then the sacred thread is offered. This is the process. Because actually, initiation cannot be given to anyone except a brahmana. So kalau sudra-sambhavah: “In the Kali-yuga, everyone is sudra.” That is to be accepted without any disagreement. Kalau sudra-sambhavah. Because they have no samskara. Asamskrtah kriya-hina mlecchah. One who is not undergone the reformatory processes, garbhadhana-samskara, upanayana-samskara… There are ten kinds of samskaras, reformatory. One who has not gone, or one who is not permitted to undergo the samskara, he’s sudra. Samskarad bhaved dvijah. Everyone is born sudra. By reformatory method, he becomes twice-born—by the spiritual master and Vedic knowledge. Vedic knowledge is the mother, and spiritual master is the father. In this way, the Jabala Upanisad… He was asked by his, by Gautama Muni, “Who is your father?” So he said that “I do not know.” “Then go to your mother. Ask her.” The mother could not say, that “I do not know who is your father. I have connection with so many men.” So he came back to Gautama Muni, “Sir, my mother also does not know.” She said that she had many connections, ‘I do not who is particularly your father.’ ” But Gautama Muni immediately accepted him, “Yes, you are brahmana, because you are truthful. Nobody dares to say like that, that ‘I do not know my father’s name. My mother said that she had many connections.’ ” Because he was truthful, satyam samo damas titiksa, so by the quality, he was accepted immediately, and he was initiated, that “You have the qualities of brahmana.” A brahmana will speak truth, even to his enemy. If the enemy comes, if a rogue comes, “How much money you have got in your box?” a brahmana will say, “Sir, I have got one hundred dollars.” (laughs) Just like the other day, in the Customs examination in Bombay, so our Brahmananda Maharaja was asked, “What is the value?” “No, I have purchased it.” “What is the value?” “Two hundred dollars.” He did not say that “I am using it for long time.” No. “It is new. I have purchased.” That’s all right. Yes. But Kali-yuga is so implicated that sometimes we have to speak the untruth. But it is the business of the brahmana to speak the truth. No untruth. So, so in this way our proposition is that if we want perfection, then in whatever position we are, either I am a brahmana, or I am a ksatriya, or I am a vaisya, or I am a sudra—it doesn’t matter, if we simply take this vow, that Krsna is the original cause of everything… A sudra is also a, the original cause is Krsna. Krsna says in the Srimad-Bhagavatam that He is the cause of the sudras. You should not hate anyone, because everyone is born of Krsna. Aham bija-pradah pita. Krsna says. Sarva-yonisu. It doesn’t matter in what form the living entity is there, but Krsna claims that He is the father, He is the father. So either brahmana or ksatriya or vaisya or sudra or mleccha, yavana, or white, black, European, American—anyone—he should know that the original cause is Krsna. This is perfection of life. idam hi pumsas tapasah srutasya va svistasya suktasya ca buddhi-dattayoh avicyuto ’rthah kavibhir nirupito yad-uttamasloka-gunanuvarnanam [SB 1.5.22] So if everyone says that “Original cause of my existence is Krsna,” this is Krsna consciousness. It doesn’t matter. Not that a brahmana… Brahmana is the mouth of Krsna, and ksatriya is the arm of Krsna, and vaisya is the belly of Krsna, and sudra is the leg of Krsna. But do we distinguish that “Here is Krsna’s mouth, or head; all the flowers should be offered here, not to the leg”? Do we make any such distinction? When we worship Krsna, rather, our first duty is to offer to the lotus feet of Krsna. And Krsna says that sudra, in Bhagavata says, sudra is the leg. So there may be distinction of profession, occupation, caste, creed, color… It doesn’t matter. But if everyone tries to become Krsna conscious, that “The original cause of my existence is Krsna,” then there is life… Life is perfect. This is our Krsna consciousness movement. Not blindly, but by research work, that how the original cause is Krsna? Krsna says, aham sarvasya prabhavo mattah sarvam pravartate [Bg. 10.8]: “I am the original cause of everything. Everything emanates from Me.” How can I deny that Krsna is not cause? This is Krsna consciousness. Therefore, those who are advanced devotee, he does not see anything else but Krsna. Because Krsna is the cause of everything. That is required. Therefore he’s Krsna consciousness. So we should not take anything neglectfully. Neither we should be careless to take care of Krsna’s property, Krsna’s living being, Krsna’s house, Krsna’s temple, Krsna’s business, Krsna’s… Everything Krsna’s. Krsna. Isavasyam idam sarvam yat kinca jagatyam jagat. If we think like that, then that is perfect Krsna consciousness. Man-mana bhava mad-bhaktah. We may think, see varieties of things. It doesn’t matter. But if we know that the original cause of this thing is Krsna, that is perfection. We are seeing this table. It is wood. But if we know… It is a fact. You know or not know, that doesn’t matter. The original cause is Krsna. The microphone, the original cause is Krsna. These karatalas, the original cause is Krsna. This pitcher, original cause is Krsna. Everything. That is Krsna consciousness. And it is fact. Not that we are imagining. Just like… Take, for example, these material things. Material things, this table. It is… How it is caused by Krsna? Krsna says, bhumir apo ’nalo vayuh kham mano buddhir eva ca. Bhumi, this earth… Bhinna prakrtir me astadha: “That is My energy.” So, so bhumi, the earth, is the cause of the tree, wood, and the wood is the cause of this table. Therefore, originally, Krsna is the cause of the table. There is no doubt about it. Anything you take. Either you take this wood or you take this water or this ether or chemical, the original cause is Krsna. Now, to be ascertained, education, that why it is called Krsna is the origin. That is research work. How it has been…? Just like I give you the hint of research work that, Krsna says that “The earth is my energy, separated energy.” And earth is the cause of the wood. And wood is the cause of the fire. Fire is the cause of melting… So many, so many. You can go. So idam hi pumsas tapasah…kavibhir nirupitah. Describe the attributes of Krsna. You can write. Just like you can write volumes of books on this table. If you are intelligent enough, you can make research work on the table. But in that research work, conclude that Krsna is the origin. A carpenter can, he can write about Krsna, if he’s thoughtful. Anyone. Therefore it is said, yad-uttamasloka-gunanuvarnanam. Whatever your profession is there, you know that the original cause is Krsna. Now make research work and find out how Krsna is the original cause. That is education. That is wanted. Am I right? Svarupa Damodara: Yes, Srila Prabhupada. Prabhupada: Yes. So everyone can write books. Everyone wants to write books, wants to show some scholarship. Do it. But the conclusion should be that “Here is the original cause.” And it is already said in the sastra… Krsna personally says that aham sarvasya prabhavo mattah sarvam pravartate iti matva bhajante mam budha bhava-samanvitah [Bg. 10.8] This is budhah. Those who are actually educated, they’re called budhah, in full knowledge. So there are departmental knowledge. So by research work, when one understands that Krsna is the original cause of everything, then that is siddhanta. Therefore Caitanya-caritamrta karaca says that siddhanta baliya citte na kara alasa iha ha-ite krsne lage sudrdha manasa Siddhanta, conclusion, try to study. Krsna says, “I am the origin of everything.” So whatever subject matter you have got, you study. Then when you come to this conclusion, “Yes, actually Krsna is the original cause,” then your devotion of Krsna immediately increases. If you accept blindly Krsna, that is one thing, another one thing. And if you study, make research work, and find out Krsna is the original cause, then your love for Krsna will increase. So this is required. This is required. So this verse is very important thing. And everyone should make research work. But a devotee, one who has concluded, one who has perfectly known that Krsna is the original cause of everything, he hasn’t got to do anything. His business is finished. He doesn’t require any more to go, undergo severe austerities to find out whether Krsna is cause or not cause. Because he has already known. He has already known. Aradhito yadi haris tapasa tatah kim. No more tapasya. Chant Hare Krsna. But if you have got doubt, make research work. You’ll have to come to the conclusion. But if you have concluded it, “Yes, Krsna is the original cause of everything,” then your business is finished. Chant Hare Krsna. But if you have got doubt, then do it. That is your business. Don’t be blind. Either you accept here the words of Krsna… Krsna says, “I am the original cause of everything.” That’s all right. If you believe that “Krsna says,” it is all right. If you do not believe, then make the research and find out. That is perfection. In both ways you’ll have to come to the… Because the fact is fact. Either… Suppose somebody says, “Don’t touch fire. It will burn your hand.” If you accept it, your father’s advice or your teacher’s advice, “Don’t touch fire,” it is as good. And if you want to make research, “No, why shall I believe my father, my teacher. Let me experiment, touch,” the result will be the same. Result will be the same. But if you want to make experiment, do it. But come to this conclusion, that Krsna is the original cause of everything. Then your life is perfect. Thank you very much. Devotees: Jaya, Srila Prabhupada. [break] Pusta-krsna(?): …translation… [break] …Bhagavad-gita… [break] Dayananda: …Prabhupada… Prabhupada: Hm. Dayananda: What is that… [break] Prabhupada: …nice. I don’t exactly… We have heard from authorities. There is no question of inquiring. What is the… Even if you don’t quote, you can assert firmly that everyone is a sudra. How? Now, guna-karma-vibhagasah. Bhagavad-gita says this classification is made, guna-karma. So what is the karma at the present moment? They’re seeking service. The so-called education means seeking service, master. Paricaryatmakam karma sudrasyapi svabhava-jam. This is sastra. Anyone who is attached to give service to others or, without giving service to others, he cannot live, that is, he’s sudra. He has no independent existence. Just like I was showing, the dog. Unemployed. Lean and thin and… Because he has no master. The same dog, when he has got a master, he’ll be stout and strong, and he’ll, as soon as you… “Owf! Owf! Bow! (laughter) I have got my master.” So this is sudra. Sudra is compared with the dog. A dog is never happy without a master. Then it is a street dog. That is the difference between household dog and a street dog. So in this age practically you see, unless there is employment, he’s a street dog. That is the proof that everyone is a sudra. That is the proof. Brahmananda: Brahmana is not to accept any employment. Prabhupada: No. He’ll die of starvation. He’ll not accept any employment. That is brahmana. Ksatriya also that, and vaisya also. Only sudra. A vaisya will find out some business. He’ll find out some business. So there is a practical story. One Mr. Nandi, long, long ago, in the Calcutta, he went to some friend that, “If you can give me a little capital, I can start some business.” So he said, “You are vaisya? Mercantile?” “Yes.” “Oh, you are asking money from me? Money’s on the street. You can find out.” So he said, “I don’t find.” “You don’t find? What is that?” “That, that is a dead mouse.” “That is your capital.” Just see. So in those days plague in Calcutta, plague was going on. So municipal declaration was any dead mouse brought to the municipal office, he’ll be paid two annas. So he took that dead body of the mouse and took to the municipal office. He was paid two annas. So he purchased some rotten betel nuts with two annas, and washed it and sold it at four annas, or five annas. In this way, again, again, again, that man became so rich man. One of their family members was our Godbrother. Nandi family. That Nandi family still, they have got four hundred, five hundred men to eat daily. A big, aristocratic family. And their family’s regulation is as soon as one son or daughter is born, five thousand rupees deposited in the bank, and at the time of his marriage, that five thousand rupees with interest, he can take it. Otherwise there is no more share in the capital. And everyone who lives in the family, he gets eating and shelter. This is their… But the original, I mean to say, establisher of this family, Nandi, he started his business with a red, a dead rat, or mouse. That is actually fact, actually fact, that if one wants to live independently… In Calcutta I have seen. Even poor class vaisyas, and in the morning they’ll take some dal, bag of dal, and go door to door. Dal is required everywhere. So in morning he makes dal business, and in evening he takes one canister of kerosene oil. So in the evening everyone will require. Still you’ll find in India, they… Nobody was seeking for employment. A little, whatever he has got, selling some ground nuts or that peanuts. Something he’s doing. After all, Krsna is giving maintenance to everyone. It is a mistake to think that “This man is giving me maintenance.” No. Sastra says, eko yo bahunam vidadhati kaman. It is confidence in Krsna, that “Krsna has given me life, Krsna has sent me here. So He’ll give me my maintenance. So according to my capacity, let me do something, and through that source, Krsna’s maintenance will come.” Just like we are maintaining so many people in the Krsna consciousness movement. So what business we are doing? But we are confident that Krsna will send us our maintenance. That confidence required. A sudra means he becomes disturbed. He becomes disturbed. “Oh, I have no employment. How shall I eat? Where shall I go? Where shall I live?” He has no faith in Krsna. The brahmana has got full faith. The ksatriya has got little less faith, the vaisya, little less faith, and the sudra has no faith. This is the difference. So your question was that how we can know a sudra? That because everyone is now faithless and everyone is seeking after employment. Therefore… We may discuss in so many ways. Because people have become sudra, therefore the capitalists are exploiting them. If everyone denies to be, serve, then these so-called industries will fail. Immediately. That is Gandhi’s proposal. “Noncooperate with the British government, and it will wind up.” And actually so happened. Because people are now sudras, they depend for their bread to others, the others exploit them: “Come here. You work and I shall give you bread.” They do not believe any more, “O God, give us our daily bread.” They think that “This, our master give us daily bread.” That is sudra. Sudra means one who is dependent on others. Paricaryatmakam karyam sudra-karma svabhava-jam. This is the description, definition of sudra. And vaisya: krsi-go-raksya-vanijyam vaisya-karma svabhava-jam [Bg. 18.44] The vaisya is doing the krsi, agriculture. Why he should depend on…? Take some land from the government. You produce your food. Where is the difficulty? Keep some cows. You get milk. Vaisya-karma svabhava… Go-raksya. If you have got excess, then make trade. Why you should depend on others? But they do not know. They want that “I shall go at ten o’clock in the office, and I shall do nothing. Simply I shall take the pen and make like this and take my salary.” That’s all. Cheating. This is going on. Therefore the whole system is polluted. Nobody’s doing his duty. Catur-varnyam maya srstam guna-karma… [Bg. 4.13]. According to one’s quality, one must work. But nobody wants to work. So therefore they are sudras. They are working, but at the care of somebody else. Not independently. Now the school, college, the teacher is also depending on salary. So they are sudras. So what teaching they will give? Teaching is the business of the brahmana. No salary. Formerly, all the brahmanas, they used to have that… It is called tola, catuspathi. Catuspathi. Brahmana, he’ll sit down anywhere and invite that “If you like, you can come and take some teachings from me.” Brahmananda: Caitanya Mahaprabhu did that. Prabhupada: Yes. So still in villages you’ll find, the brahmana is sitting somewhere, and the small children are coming, and they’re bringing some presentation. Somebody’s bringing rice, somebody … And brahmana was satisfied, satisfied. “Whatever Krsna sends, that’s all right.” This is brahminical qualification. He doesn’t want more. There was a brahmana teacher in Krsnanagara. So the zamindar of Krsna…, Raja-krsna-candra, he went that “Brahmana, what can I help you?” “No, I don’t want your help.” “No, you are… Your house is not very good, and your…” “No, I am quite satisfied.” “How you are pulling on?” “No, I have got my students. They bring some rice. And here is a tamarind tree. My wife collects some leaves and boils it, and that becomes nice soup. And these boys bring some rice. I am quite satisfied.” [break] “…as your production is there, give me twenty-five percent. I’ll give you protection.” That is ksatriya business. Brahmana’s business, teaching. And vaisya: till the field, agriculture, get your food. Now, where is dependence? Only a sudra, he cannot take up all these things. “Give me some service, sir. Give me some service.” In the modern education, they… The more and more industries increasing, there sudras are being trained up. Technology. Technology means he must get some service. Otherwise, useless. Simple life, teaching, brahmana; and ksatriya, give protection; and vaisya, till the ground. This is… Where is the question of scarcity? The scarcity is that nobody’s doing his real duty. Guna-karma-vibhagasah. And people are exploiting. There is competition, dissatisfaction, fight. So many things, sinful activities. The whole society is polluted. Actually, the whole human society is now conducted by the sudras. But sudras cannot run on government. That is not possible. Because that sudra, your Nixon, is a sudra, he is exalted post, therefore everything is not in order. Brahmananda: Ksatriyas should run the government? Prabhupada: Oh, yes. Brahmananda: And the brahmanas should give advice. Prabhupada: Yes. That is Vedic system. The brahmanas would never take part in administration. They would give advice according to sastra. Svarupa Damodara: I have a comment on that research. Prabhupada: Hm. Svarupa Damodara: You said that researches are all right, but there has to be a standard. Prabhupada: Yes. Svarupa Damodara: It has to be standardized. Prabhupada: Yes. Research. Svarupa Damodara: Yes. Prabhupada: Yes. So that is the business of the research scholar, how to make it standardized. Everything is standardized. Just like you have found the molecules, protons, and… They are working in a standardized way. They are not working whimsically there. There is standard process. Svarupa Damodara: And what is that standard? What is that standard of research? Prabhupada: The standard is already there. Is not that? Svarupa Damodara: Yes, but… Prabhupada: Standard is already there. Krsna has already made the standard. Our intelligence is to know how the standard has come. Svarupa Damodara: So we say that brahma-jijnasa is a standard. Is that, is that…? Is that okay? Prabhupada: Brahma-jijnasa means… Anything you take, it is working in a standard way. Just like the sun is rising. So the brahma-jijnasa means how the sun is rising exactly in time? Who has made this rule? And in astronomy there is very fine calculation, one ten-thousandth part of a minute or something like that? I have heard from you scientists. They, they make calculation of the movement of the sun, that. In astrology also, the moment is calculated like that. If the exact moment is there, by mathematical calculation, he can give you the exact history of your whole life. This is standard, all standard. Niyamitah. Yasyajnaya bhramati kala-cakrah. There is, Brahma-samhita says: yac-caksur esa savita sakala-grahanam raja samasta-sura-murtir asesa-tejah yasyajnaya bhramati sambhrta-kala-cakro govindam adi-purusam tam aham bhajami How exactly the sun and the moon and the planets, they are rotating? How? Yasyajnaya, by whose order? That Govinda, adi-purusa, I offer my respectful… Everywhere you’ll find the research. Svarupa Damodara: But the difference between the transcendentalists and the scientists is that they do not know the standard of research. Prabhupada: Yes. Therefore we say they are fools. Why do we say mudhah? Because they do not know. And our business is easy. We take Vedic version, Krsna’s version, Brahma’s version, Vyasadeva’s version, and accept. That’s all. Which one is easiest? Our business is very simple. You ask your father… A child asks his father, “Father, what is this?” The father says, “This is microphone, my dear child.” And he will, “Mother, this is microphone.” So when he says this “Mother, this is microphone,” is he correct or not? Svarupa Damodara: Yes, he is. Prabhupada: He’s correct. He may be child. But because he has accepted the words of his father, the statement is correct. So our process is that. Take the version of the authority, Krsna, and you repeat it. Your version is perfect. This is our policy. Therefore Caitanya Mahaprabhu says, “You rascal scholar, philosopher, scientist, don’t manufacture anything. Yare dekha tare kaha krsna-upadesa [Cc. Madhya 7.128] That’s all. You become master.” Yare dekha tare kaha krsna-upadesa [Cc. Madhya 7.128]. You become master. You can teach others. A spiritual master. That’s all. And if, whatever little success I have got—only for this reason. I have never said anything which is not spoken by Krsna. I never said, “In my opinion.” I never said. You are so many students. I never said that to you. What is my opinion? One should know, “What is the value of my opinion? I am imperfect being.” This is called trnad api sunicena taror api sahisnuna. If one thinks, “Oh, I am big scholar. I am this. I am that,” you are rascal. You have to simply carry the message of Krsna. But for your understanding you can make research work. Svarupa Damodara: That is the secret. Prabhupada: Yes, that is the secret. yasya deve para bhaktir yatha deve tatha gurau tasyaite kathita hy arthah prakasante mahatmanah [SU 6.23] If one has got unflinching faith in Krsna and his representative, guru, then all the knowledge will be revealed to him automatically. Just like yourself. You are a big scientist. You have talked with me, you have studied with me, and you have examined me in so many ways. And I have also spoken whatever I had knowledge. Unless you are convinced, how you can say that “You are my spiritual master”? So what is the secret? I am not a scientist. I am not M.A., C.A How do you agree to accept me as spiritual master? Because I stick to this principle, Krsna and guru, that’s all. This is the secret of guru. So today is Baladeva avirbhava. Baladeva, in the strength. Nayam atma bala-hinena labhyah. You cannot understand, realize yourself without the help of Baladeva. Therefore in the Vedic literatures: nayam atma bala-hinena labhyah. You cannot become self-realized without the help of, without the mercy of Baladeva. Now, our Vivekananda Swami, he interpreted that “Unless you become stout and strong like the bulls and the buffalo, you cannot realize self.” He interpreted like that. So he engaged people to make gymnastics, exercise. “You become very stout and strong, eat meat, and…” This is going on. This philosophy is going on. Bala-hinena… “Unless you become as strong as a tiger, you cannot realize yourself.” This interpretation is going on. Bala-hinena labhyah. Therefore they are… Always they put this argument, that “Our countrymen is suffering. There is no food. First of all we must give them food, make them strong, stout. Then we shall talk about Krsna consciousness.” Do they not say like that? Brahmananda: Yes. Prabhupada: This is another nonsense. Bala-hinena does not mean this physical strength. Bala-hin… Bala, bala means spiritual strength, Baladeva. Baladeva is spiritual strength. Nityananda. Balarama haila nitai. Brahmananda: Hina, hina. Bala-hina? Prabhupada: Hina means without. And bala means strength. So sastra says, nayam atma bala-hinena labhyah: “One who is less strong, or one who has no support of the strength, then he cannot make any progress in spiritual self-realization.” This is the Vedic injunction. So they interpret that unless you become physically strong, you cannot make any spiritual advancement. So…? But in the Western countries we have seen, so many people physically very strong, stout and strong. Practically everyone. But what is their self…, advancement in self-realization? So these things are going on. So bala means spiritual strength, not material strength. Nayam atma bala-hinena labhyah. That means one must be spiritually strong. And that spiritually strong means to have good faith in Krsna and guru. That is spiritual strength. Therefore Baladeva means guru, spiritual strength. Balarama haila nitai. Nitaiyer karuna habe… What is that song? Nitaiyer karuna habe vraje radha-krsna pabe. He is… “If there is mercy of Nitai, then…” That Visansena(?), call him. (calls out to someone who is apparently leaving) Serji, aiye na? (Hindi) Indian: (Hindi) Prabhupada: Aiye, saheb. Indian: (Hindi) Prabhupada: Aiye. Indian: (Hindi) What is… What shall I do, coming? Prabhupada: Sit down. You can make some space. Aiye. Indian: (Hindi) Prabhupada: [break] …the verse from Srimad-Bhagavatam, idam hi pumsas tapasah srutasya va svistasya suktasya ca buddhi-dattayoh avicyuto ’rthah kavibhir nirupito yad-uttamasloka-gunanuvarnanam [SB 1.5.22] That everyone is situated in some business, occupation. So it is the duty of the person, never mind in whatever occupation he is engaged, uttamasloka-gunanuvarnanam, to glorify the Supreme Lord. It doesn’t matter whether he is a medical man or he is an engineer or a lawyer, or whatever he may be, politician… His only business is by his occupational duties to glorify the Supreme Personality of Godhead. This is the basic principle of Krsna consciousness movement. We do not advise that you change your place. There is no need of changing place. Sthane sthitah. This is the Brahma’s version. Sthane sthitah sruti-gatam tanu-van-manobhih. You remain your, in your occupation, your position, but kindly hear. Therefore we have got so many sastras, Vedic… Therefore the Vedic literature is known as sruti. One has to hear. But that education is lacking. Nobody is hearing the Vedic literatures. They are hearing so many other things, but not… Therefore Bhagavata says, srotavyadini rajendra nrnam santi sahasrasah. Srotavyadini. The business is to hear. But, srotavyadini rajendra nrnam santi sahasrasah apasyatam atma-tattvam grhesu grha-medhinam [SB 2.1.2] Grhesu. We are now compact in our home. You take universal home or your house home or this body home, we are within. So grhesu grha-medhinam. Because we have taken that the home business is everything. Grhesu grha-medhinam. And who has taken like this? Apasyatam atma-tattvam [SB 2.1.2], one who cannot see the, “What is the value of my existence,” atma-tattvam. So for them, srotavyadini rajendra nrnam santi sahasrasah [SB 2.1.2], they have got many things to hear. Here, of course, in India, we have got newspaper, four pages, five pages, but in the foreign countries, especially in America, they’ll present newspaper, so big. Therefore there is paper scarcity. You see? Unnecessarily printing so much, huge quantity of newspapers. And people… Sometimes they do not touch it. The newspaper man throws in everyone’s bungalow, and it is lying for three days. So who is going to read? But they are making their business because they get advertisement. In the… Many news. So they have got to hear or understand so many news, but not this Bhagavatam. They’ll devote the whole day for reading this newspaper or some fiction or some novels, for this and that. Some political talks and… But they have no time to hear Srimad-Bhagavatam and Bhagavad-gita. Apasyatam atma… Because they have no, no interest in self-realization. There is no interest. People have lost all interest. This is the position. Therefore this Krsna consciousness movement is essential at the present moment. Now, these European and Americans, they have enough heard about all these nonsense. Therefore they are anxious to hear about self- realization. srotavyadini rajendra nrnam santi sahasrasah apasyatam atma-tattvam grhesu grha-medhinam [SB 2.1.2] (Hindi) He was punishable. It was the duty of the government to see that “You are posing yourself as brahmana. Whether you are doing the duty of a brahmana?” If he’s not doing, then he was punished. Therefore nobody was unemployed. A brahmana is doing his duty, ksatriya’s doing his duty, vaisya his duty. We get this information from Maharaja Prthu’s kingdom. He, he was very strict, that whether one is doing his duty. Catur-varnyam maya srstam guna-karma-vibhagasah [Bg. 4.13] If the brahmana is doing his duty, the ksatriya is doing his duty, and vaisya is doing his duty, then where is the unemployment? And it is the duty of the government to see that everyone is doing his duty. Indian: (indistinct) Prabhupada: No, no. Society means this combination of all these men. So if everyone is doing his duty, then it is quite all right. That is perfect society. Society means some combination of men. So if every man perfectly does his duty, then there is no question of imperfect… Indian: (indistinct) Prabhupada: Yes. That is the difficulty. That is the difficulty. That I was explaining, that at the present moment mostly persons, they are sudras. Just like in your body there are four divisions. Your head division, your arm division, your belly division, and your leg division. And if you cut off everything, simply you keep the legs, then what will be done? So at the present moment there is no brahmana, no ksatriya. Maybe some vaisyas only. Only sudras. Therefore there is chaos. If the division is made, kept, as it is advised in the Bhagavad-gita, catur-varnyam maya srstam guna-karma-vibhagasah [Bg. 4.13], according to guna and karma, then the society is maintained very nicely, properly. If your head is working nicely, if your arms are working nicely, if your stomach is working nicely, leg is working…, then you are fit. But if you have got only legs, and head, there is no head, there is no arm, then what is the…? Dead society. So we are giving education at the present moment to become sudras. Paricaryatmakam karyam sudra-karma svabhava-jam. To serve others. A brahmana will not serve anyone else. A ksatriya will not serve anyone else. A vaisya will not serve anyone else. Only the sudras. So at the present moment we are giving sudra education. Everyone is taking one application: “Give me some service.” “No vacancy, sir.” Therefore it is said, kalau sudra-sambhavah. In the Kali-yuga everyone is sudra. And how you can have good government by the sudras? Ksatriya required. Just like Maharaja Pariksit. He was touring. As soon as he saw one man is killing cow, “Who are you, rascal, killing cow in my kingdom?” Ksatriya. Give protection. Even to the cows. Praja means one who has taken birth in that land. Why he should not be given protection? But because they are sudras, they do not know what is the ksatriya’s duty, what is the government’s duty. This is the position. Am I right or wrong? Indian: (indistinct) Prabhupada: No, I am speaking according to our sastras. Indian: (indistinct) Prabhupada: No, no. In those days the whole planet was Bharatavarsa. Therefore it is called Mahabharata. Indian: (indistinct) Prabhupada: That was not small. That was very big. Pariksit Maharaja was going on tour because he was the emperor of the whole planet. Indian: (indistinct) Prabhupada: Now it is divided. Indian: (indistinct) Prabhupada: No, that was another thing. That was for, fight for the right cause. Not for… It may be politically like that, but the division was there, brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya, sudra. And the last, Krsna’s compromising plan was that “After all, they are ksatriyas, these five brothers. They cannot take the business of a vaisya or brahmana. So give them five villages so that they may be satisfied, ruling over these…” “No, not even land holding the upper portion of the needle.” Then there was fight. Then there was fight. So as far as possible… Of course, our, this movement is creating brahmanas. People now require a brahmana, the head. Of course, we are not manufacturing anything. Everything is there. Everything is there in the sastra. We do not invent anything. Yah sastra-vidhim utsrjya vartate kama-karatah. The, we, are trying to follow as far as possible, and we are teaching that, that whatever is there… Indian: (indistinct) Prabhupada: You are coming from Burdow?(?) Indian: (indistinct) Prabhupada: Near Lucknow? Indian: No. Indian: Bareilly. Prabhupada: Bareilly. Oh. Indian: (indistinct) Prabhupada: Oh. (end)
by His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada
Vrndavana, August 3, 1974